DEMO2 BEFORE BUYING

[AJ]

I love the concept and I am studying the manual and trying to put it into practice in demo1 before committing to buy.  However I find demo1 full of bugs etc..  I do want to purchase but I need to see a workable and stable demo before I buy. 
Is it possible to allow non Grenadiers to have Demo2 now.

[Rustem]

...
Is it possible to allow non Grenadiers to have Demo2 now.

I agree !

[Petrus58]

I may be wrong, but as I understand it, demo II is currently being beta-tested by those who have pre-ordered, and will eventually be given a general release. My impression - which I think is shared by most, if not all - is that demo II is a significant improvement and is well worth waiting for.

[JCM101]

I pre-ordered & have just been playing Demo #2 with patch #2 = much improved 

JMM has clearly been listening to criticism & bug reports & has made many 'repairs'.
I imagine (but don't 'know') that it will soon be on general release. 

It was definitely worth waiting for.

[LNDavout]

Guys Demo 2 is really good and the game will improve even after release.

So join us with the game and have fun to improve it.

As JCM101 sad. 

[AJ]

I am probably going to say something that will upset a lot of people, so let me precede this by acknowledging the enormous amount of work that the team has put into this project.  I also have full confidence that the project will be wildly successful.

However, when a group of people are so totally immersed in a project they can lose sight of the broader picture ("You can't see the woods for the trees").
As a business man, I know that when I give a free sample of my product to someone in the hope that they will buy: It better work!!

Demo1 is unstable and unpredictable and to the world outside of the "Grenadiers", will not sell the simulation. The Manual is confusing, overly complicated, repetitive and presumes a high level of war gaming knowledge has already been attained. To this end, I humbly suggest the manual is reviewed by a non war gaming, game designer ( Graphic Trees, illustrating examples of Command and Movement scenarios, would help).
I understand that Demo2 is being evaluated so that this situation is rectified, good.  Then and only then, will the "Conscripts" consider buying it. 

I also understand that this is not primarily a commercial project, but rather a labor of love.  The simulation will not appeal to the general gamer but rather to us blessed few who were bitten, at a tender age, by the bug when we played with our first lead soldiers (as I was). I do however beg you members of the Elite "Grenadiers" to remember; that the backbone of an Army is it's humble "Conscripts".  You must feed our bellies so that we fight well!!!!!!!!!!

[MCBlewett]

Truer words have nerer been spoken.

[little soldier]

I understand perfectly what you say and you've every right to 'wait and see what happens'. As it is, I, some time ago, pre-ordered in the understanding that it was some kind of a risk. Now, I still don't regret my decision because for me HWLG is more than a game, but also some kind of a project destined to give grognards a chance to play Napoleonic wargames. By the way, it's quite interesting to try out the demo II and JMM really listens to comments made by the grenadiers.

[AJ]

With all due respect.  We can't try out demo2 yet (not available to us) and it's the comments from the "Conscripts" that JMM needs to consider too.

[little soldier]

Correct.

[JMM]

The first demo was released in very bad conditions... The feedback was very hard but I can understand because this first package wasn't the best.

So, I have to be very careful for avoiding a new bad package.
I know a lot of people are waiting for the demoII. Sorry for this frustration, but this second package must be right, otherwise the consequences will be terrible.

HW:LG presents a lot of features, and because there are a lot of features, maybe it's a bit more complex to find the different problems. Now, I believe it runs right at 99.9...%, so sometimes there are some issues. My intention isn't to get 100%, but I have to delete some annoying bugs before releasing the second demo.

So, I hope I a clear and you understand my intention.

JMM

[AJ]

Thank you JMM, I think you are absolutely correct.  When I try demo2, I want to be able to say "This is great, now I'm going to buy it".

Please, please consider adding "Graphics Trees to the Manual".  There really does need to be some simple A to Z graphics of various movement and command scenarios.

Keep up the good work Mon General.

[HarryInk]

Ah ha, a word from le general and the troops are settled.  What good will there is here! (and just when the panicky were considering a 'whiff of grapeshot' :P  )

I do believe your concerns are all correct.  The idea of a demo is try before you buy and surely that is the intention histwar has in making it.  So, your patience will be rewarded.  

Ajlewisbrookes, being a visual type, I like the idea of 'graphics trees' but I'm not quite sure where you would use them.  Could you provide an example?

[Duke of Earl]

Bonjour Messieurs,

I agree with Msr. Brookes ....

That said, HW:LG concepts are probably only encountered in military academies ....  

But, most 'rank-and-file' wargamers have no such knowledge (no disrespect intended, but things were different back then, just ask G. Washington) .... and Demo 1 would be a sure-fire loser to them ....  like it or not, we live in a predominately arcade world ....

Why? Not many (if any) 'mainstream' history books go into detail about Napoleonic battle concepts presented in HW:LG .... so some consideration must be given to a 'bridge-the-gap' education angle in the marketplace ....  

OK, philosophy rant over ... back to business .... *cracks open another cold-one* ....  

Cordialement, DoE

[Hook]

I have to agree with Duke of Earl.

Believe it or not, there were sound business reasons for releasing the first demo when it was, no matter what condition it was in at the time.  After breaking with the previous publisher, JMM had to show the world that he had a product, any product, or people would have ripped him to shreds on various other forums.

And I'm glad he did release that first demo.  I took one look and realized that no matter what kind of bugs we saw, we had a solid game that would eventually be polished into the best Napoleonic game that's ever existed.  When I pre-ordered the game, I figured I was paying for the demo, and even if I never got anything else I'd have been happy.

The thing that's so special about HWLG for me is that it incorporates almost everything I know about Napoleonic warfare, and I've been studying that for decades.   All the things written by various theorists of the period and in personal accounts has come to life in the game.  All that and I get to view the battle through the eyes of the men on the field, something we've never had before, and even though the scale is about 3x normal size due to the fact that each figure represents 10 men, it's accurate enough to give a good feel for the warfare of the period.  You can see the massive scale of these battles.

I am most definitely a Napoleonic enthusiast, and the game speaks to me in a way that no others have.  I've learned things from the game that you can't learn from books, because sometimes you just have to see the process in action.  I saw things that I questioned at first, but upon further study I understood and agreed with them.

Napoleonic warfare is fascinating, partially because of the way the weapons and tactics blended together to form a balanced whole.  To me, the Napoleonic period is the pinnacle of warfare.  Some people won't be as interested in it as I am, but that's ok.  For those who are interested, grab this game while you can because you'll probably never see anything like it again.

A more casual gamer might be put off a bit because of all the new things to learn; but if you stay with it, you may find you like it.  This won't be like any other game you've ever played.  HWLG is a serious wargame and a simulation, but that doesn't mean it's not fun.  If you're new to this genre or this type of warfare, play for a while and you'll begin to understand the game and how it works, and you may find that it's a great experience.  And you'll definitely learn more about the Napoleonic battlefield than many Famous Historians ever did.

Hook