demo

[Gunner24]

The air bursts do appear to be too high, for my liking, but it's such a small issue compared to other things - who really cares ?.

[von Döbeln]

It's definitely not a big issue, but since JMM has gone through the trouble of giving us airbursts it would be nice to see them. As it is now they are usually too high up in the air to see if you are anywhere near the area with the camera.

LvD

[Franciscus]

Wow, lots of anguish over here...and as would be expected, some of the most fervent banner-waving past worshipers are among the most disappointed ones

Relax, guys, it is just a game. And as any reasonable PC-gamer knows, there are NO perfect games, there are even no finished games at release time. EVERY PC game is unfinished and buggy at release. But only some go through the necessary patching. Why would you expect LG to be different ?
Even if the game gets more delays, even if it is released only in 2020, it will always have bugs.

Some feedback from my limited testing of the demo:

I only played the first 2 tutorials yet, due to lack of free time 
I am playing in a desktop PC with WinXP SP2, Intel Core 2 7400, 4 Gig RAM, ATI 4670. Directx 9.0c and ATI 9.4 drivers.

- Installation went fine. The unfortunate error in the start menu link should have been corrected prior to release and must not happen in the final game.
- Clunky (as expected) but complete and complex interface
- 3D graphics serviceable (as expected). Amazing variety of views of the battlefield
- Clumsy english translation - as expected 
- A very complex gameplay - and some of the problems I and others are facing have to do with it. More feedback - visual, audible, text - would go a long way to make things clearer. For instance, to understand if a corps commander has indeed received orders or not. If he is going to fulfill them or not and why. Why a unit routs. Etc. And I definitely must read TFM 
- No CTD so far. Not even while hovering in the edges of the maps...
- First tutorial: Noticed the teleporting of the arty and cav units and the "disappearance" of the inf unit (in the 3d views - they seem to be there in the 2d view)
- Second tutorial: No major problems. No disappearing units, no teleporting, no CTD. Again some feedback of what my corps commander was doing with my orders would be good. One of my scouting cav units got too close to the enemy and then routed. The only feedback was seeing them move with the "Escape" order in the unit card. I do not understand exactly why they routed, as no fight took place and they were in good shape, apparently, and I also do not understand why they did not rally. I gave my corps commander orders to rally all units. The fleeing unit went pass my full-force advancing corps and my corps and army commander but kept running until they disappeared. My other cav unit went to the flank of the austrians. I gave an order to attack, they advanced but then they stopped and kept still, no matter what orders I gave them (attack, move). Maybe some bugs, but maybe also something that is happening that I do not understand or have done wrong. Again, more feedback would be great.

Nevertheless, I am enjoying it so far. I am going to buy the game when it is released. The problems that have been reported, specially the CTDs some have experienced, and the disappearing units, must be corrected. But even so I fully expect the game to have bugs, probably lots of them. And I expect JMM to patch them, of course 

Regards

[Hook]

Your Escaping cavalry might have come under fire from either artillery or infantry, or may simply have been overwhelmed by the fact that it had so many enemy units nearby and no friendly units, and probably already had lowered morale because of fatigue.  As far as I know, an Escaping unit cannot be rallied.

As far as I know, a unit will not charge an enemy unit unless it feels it has some chance of victory. 

So many things to learn about this game.

Hook

[englishoo7]

You might be right. All the enemy infantry were in line and ordered and there were no friendlies about? But leaving the field of battle is a bit drastic, all four thousand of them?
I do think I have quite a bit to learn about the game. Which is good. I wonder if some of these concerns could be put to rest by the beta testers as I expect JMM is busy?

[Shaka69001]

Long time lurker here but still very excited about the game.

I just read on the French forum that yesterday JMM said that the Demo AI is indeed different to the full game:

Citation de: Maréchal_Darsh le Hier a 21:33:03
Après avoir plusieurs fois la même bataille de montebello, j'ai constaté que le corps autrichien qui tient l'aile gauche n'a jamais bougé d'un iota et je trouve ça un peu frustrant.

Est-il vrai que l'IA a été bridé dans la démo?

JMM responded
Elle est incomplète et purement passive -comme je l'ai mentionné dans un topic Info (mais vous lisez pas
Je ne dis pas qu'en version complète, elle va déchirer.. mais je pense qu'elle sera un opposant honnête...

JMM

Roughly translated and summarised, "the AI is incomplete and passive" in the demo (as he apparently has already said - "comme je l'ai mentionné dans un topic Info".)

Shaka

[Franciscus]

Well, I played again the 2nd tutorial and had a "disappearing" unit. I placed my arty in a small knoll to the south of the austrians, with a cav in support and happily blasted away at the poor austrians. I was playing at max speed and was paying attention to the rest of the corps, when "suddenly" the icon of the arty (in 2d) disappeared  . Then I noticed the austrian arty had advanced and started to shell my arty, that did not budge (shouldn't it ?), my cav did not budge (should it ?) and in the 3d view I could see the wrecks of all my cannons and the corpses of my gunners. I could still "select" and order my arty wrecks (I shouldn't, should I ?), and it still showed left ammo, fatigue, morale (which was pretty good  ), etc   , but in the statistics menu it showed alright as an arty unit lost.

So: a stupid error of mine. The arty own AI should (?) have retreated (?). Some feedback would have been nice ("we are under attack !!"  ), and the unit should be clearly out of combat - no orders or fatigue, etc. should appear when one clicks on wrecks  

[dmcheatw]

is anyone else having trouble getting units to move?  in the tutorial I can't get a unit to change formation, nor can I get a unit to move forward.  i see the line made up of triangles, but how do i "confirm" the move order, so to speak?

[trw2264]

Artillery bounce: Last night I did see artillery bounce. It was the area fire and the I saw the dust hit in from of the allies and then I saw the dust hit amongst the allied troops. I have crossfire ATI 4870 video cards.

[Uxbridge]

I played the third tutorial last night. My corps advanced as ordered to take up a line facing the Austrians. Then the screen minimised. I restored it. The time had jumped to the morning of the next day, all my infantry were "escaping" and my cavalry (accompanied by the artillery) were moving toward the enemy conducting a rear guard operation.
In one sense, clever and realistic, with the Corps protecting itself. But obviously the demo is simply unplayable in this form, and there was no obvious reason for why the infantry had panicked. At the least, the option to save the game, and to save as many saved games as one wants, would assist in this sort of problem (which I get now and then with other games as well, but not with the time-jump). But I gather that the way to save the game is by exiting.

[englishoo7]

  Today I repleyed the demo. I attatched some elite regiments to II Corps and ordered it to deploy on an Austrian defensive line in 2 lines with 25% reserves in column formation. I supported this corps with another corps, then detatched some artillery, ordered them forward. Behind these I set up another defensive line with I Corps just behind the first.
  :!:The Corps swung into action. The regiments looked great advancing accross the valley (the graphics I think give a certain something despite not being cutting edge). The supporting corps cavalry charged the enemy and the Austrian cavalry answered in kind. Some of my infantry were cut up by their artillery but the rest kept on.  Regiment after regiment crested the feature and broke down into attack columns opposite the Austrian infantry in line looking on. My Infantry advanced, rolling I hoped through the Austrian lines... the musket fire was just about to begin when.... all my infantry dissapeared? about 3 or 4 regiments just vanished

  Now, I had spent an hour or more setting this up and I had missed 'the best part, the firefight'. BUT, I think for the first time I had really seen what this game could be... I really enjoyed the build up! If (and I really hope for this) the full game does not have regiments dissapearing or just sat about watching other enemy regiments, I could see for the first time the sort of satisfaction you could get from setting up and seeing through a setpiece attack....

Please, please could one of the beta testers confirm that regiments dont just dissapear or sit watching each other or cavvalry (4000 of them) don't just leave the field without suffering a casualty?
With silly behaviour like this sorted I am now convinced this could be a classic game!
P.S. (We really need to be able to easily order individual divisions too/maybe in a patch).

[englishoo7]

 Today I repleyed the demo. I attatched some elite regiments to II Corps and ordered it to deploy on an Austrian defensive line in 2 lines with 25% reserves in column formation. I supported this corps with another corps, then detatched some artillery, ordered them forward. Behind these I set up another defensive line with I Corps just behind the first.
  :!:The Corps swung into action. The regiments looked great advancing accross the valley (the graphics I think give a certain something despite not being cutting edge). The supporting corps cavalry charged the enemy and the Austrian cavalry answered in kind. Some of my infantry were cut up by their artillery but the rest kept on.  Regiment after regiment crested the feature and broke down into attack columns opposite the Austrian infantry in line looking on. My Infantry advanced, rolling I hoped through the Austrian lines... the musket fire was just about to begin when.... all my infantry dissapeared? about 3 or 4 regiments just vanished

 Now, I had spent an hour or more setting this up and I had missed 'the best part, the firefight'. BUT, I think for the first time I had really seen what this game could be... I really enjoyed the build up! If (and I really hope for this) the full game does not have egiments dissapearing or just sat about watching other enemy regiments, I could see for the first time the sort of satisfaction you could get from setting up and seeing through a setpiece attack....

Please, please could one of the beta testers confirm that regiments dont just dissapear or sit watching each other or cavvalry (4000 of them) don't just leave the field without suffering a casualty?
With silly behaviour like this sorted I am now convinced this could be a classic game!
P.S. (We really need to be able to easily order individual divisions too/maybe in a patch).

Sorry, don't speak French, hit citation by mistake.

[Hook]

Sorry, don't speak French, hit citation by mistake.

Click on the upper right where it says "Change the forum language".  At least I hope that's what it says... I've already done it and everything is in English.

Hook

[Uxbridge]

Englishoo7, I had the same experience. Set up a foggy day and watching the troops appear up a slope out of the mist was just perfect, all I had hoped for from LG. Then the screen minimised and when it came back an entire Corps had gone - 0 troops left. One of the others showed 260% casualties. I got them to advance up a  hill toward the Russians and put the camera behind the Russian lines to savour what it must have been like facing a French assault - and by magic the Russians vanished. Then the screen minimised again and we pick up the scene several hours later, lots more of my army mysteriously vanished or escaping or routing and very few of the enemy left either.

So did I win a glorious victory?

JMM, I think this game could be entrancingly wonderful. But the flaws are obvious. I will buy it but only when I can play through a battle without having this sort of experience.

[MoonDog]

Hi Folks, Bonjour from Ireland,
I’ve been following this game dev for around 6 months and decided to post my thoughts re demo etc.
   
So people have a problem with the demo, relax the head and wait for the final release. It seems that this has made some people rethink buying the game. WTF guys! If you are here at all it is because you want this game and JMM and team to succeed. Consider the time and effort you and him have given to following the game dev, don’t throw that away. So what if the release is not the best it could be, I’m sure that JMM will fix it in time. If there are still problems with the game up to release date then I say “publish and be damned” (as a famous Irish man once said). Help him with your money and constructive criticisms.
   I for one will be buying the game no matter what (and I’m not that big of a Nappy nerd nor would be very good at playing the game). You see I want the independent game dev scene to continue. In the future this scene might end up being the only one left to cater for quality PC games in general and strategy games in particular. JMM does not have a huge budget to spend on dev and unlike the big players he cannot spend large sums on media promotions to sell what ends up being pretty and semi stable but ultimately crappy games – eg Farcry2 or CoD MW2. He needs your help and money. How many times have you gone and bought a game based on a magazine rating only to bin it after a couple of hours play – you take the hit and move on – do it with this game if it come to that. (Who here complains about console games destroying PC games, well now is your chance to support the PC games development scene.

Now, I have to suggest that there needs to be some kind of structure put in place for the management of the feedback info from the demo to make changes easier. Whoever is in charge of this forum or the demo or the game dev needs to do something.
My suggestion would be that a thread needs to be started for each of the areas in the game that people are complaining about eg:

2d map
3d graphics
Gameplay
Unit commands/Control
AI
O/S – ok this has been done with the sticky regarding CTDs

Anyways well done to JMM and team – it I hope you succeed (and good luck in the World Cup – you’re going to fecking need it. 

Below are a few things that frustrated me about the running of the demo.
About the camera movement:
WTF JMM. – Go with what works. There is a standard out there and its great. The A,W,D,S keys should be used to move the camera around the battle field. Right-click mouse and moving mouse should control panning around. Its simple with no bull shit. Don’t be reinventing the wheel when there is one there already and be prepared to dump interface features that could put some people off – if you give them what they are used to in the interface then they will allow for glitches in other areas (think Microsoft here). Anyways there is enough to learn within the game without having to get to grips with the controls.

Another thing. If I click on a unit in 3d view its unit info comes up as well as the context menu. But the problem is that if I then just move the cursor over some other unit I have lost the unit info for the unit that I clicked and obviously wanted. Plus when I click on a unit I should be able to scroll the mouse to get to that units superior officer etc. This works perfectly in Manassas so why do it differently.

If ever the left click context menu comes up for a unit then it should also contain an option to move the camera to this unit in the 3d view.

Ok another couple of things before I go.
The F2 – 2d big-map: it has the unit info box semi-permanently located on the right hand side. This covers a major portion of the map(!!!), limiting the users view and ability to issue orders (I know this unit info box flips to the left but that’s bullshit – put it on the bottom of the screen underneath the map along with any other info boxes/options or buttons that can appear on this screen/map. Also the unit icons on this map can get very clustered on top of each other making it very hard to click on the one you want – make these icon smaller or add an option to zoom in on this map.

Should the 2d mini-map contain little dots representing all troops ?!

Could some of the more experienced players do some helpful training videos?

Lastly. I had to run the game .exe with admin rights in XP. Why?

All the best


My setup on which the game works fine:
XP SP2
Nvidia 7900GTX
2 Gig RAM
AMD Opteron @ 1.8Ghz

And
XP SP2
Lenovo T60
Intel 945 Express Gfx
1 Gig RAM
Core Duo T2300 @ 1.66Ghz